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Can allowing children to express anger actually foster their emotional growth? Unravel this essential parenting dilemma with licensed marriage and family therapist Bronwyn Schweigerdt. Bronwyn shares her compelling transition from a career in nutrition to becoming a therapist, fueled by her own battles with depression. We discuss the often misunderstood role of anger in child development, emphasizing that it should not be suppressed or shamed. Instead, parents should guide their children through their emotions with boundaries and assertiveness, creating a safe environment where mistakes become learning opportunities.
Explore the intricate dynamics of healthy relationship boundaries and the significance of personal accountability with Bronwyn’s expert insights. We delve into the realms of self-awareness and maturity, highlighting how true growth stems from introspection and humility. Learn why it’s vital to acknowledge personal faults and take responsibility for your own feelings and behaviors. Finally, uncover the manipulative conversational tactics that can distort reality and shift blame, providing a deeper understanding of emotional intelligence and the complexities of interpersonal communication. Join us for an episode that promises to enrich your emotional toolkit and transform your relationships.
Bronwyn Schweigerdt | website |
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An SDYT Media Production I Deviate from the Norm
All rights reserved. 2021
Transcript
WEBVTT
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Welcome to Transacting Value, where we talk about practical applications for personal values when dealing with each other and even within ourselves.
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Where we foster a podcast listening experience that lets you hear the power of a value system for managing burnout, establishing boundaries and finding belonging.
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My name is Josh Porthouse, I'm your host and we are your people.
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This is why values still hold value.
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This is Transacting Value.
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How can we expect a little human to grow if they don't have a safe environment to make loads of mistakes within?
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Because we can't grow without making lots and lots of mistakes and learning from that.
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Today on Transacting Value within the scope of all your relationships.
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How do you handle the guaranteed rupture repair cycle?
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Whether or not it's your fault, whether or not it's your problem, you're accountable only in so many ways as how you handle the repair.
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Now, what do you do when you're angry?
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How do you handle phases of differentiation, developing a conscious effort and self-awareness and living in the tension In our conversation with Bronwyn Schweigerdt?
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She's back on the show and without further ado.
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I'm Porter, I'm your host and this is Transacting Value, Bronwyn, how you doing.
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I'm good.
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Thank you, Porter.
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I appreciate you coming back on the show, especially, in my opinion, so soon.
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I mean you basically just left.
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We were talking about your practice.
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We were talking about your podcast, Angry at the Right Things, which I hope is going well.
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Yeah, good Congratulations.
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And here, more recently, you just got done traveling the West Coast, having a good time in the mountains, seeing nature, grounding, I suppose.
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But for anybody new to the show, before we get too much into you and I, let's start with you, take a couple minutes.
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Who are you, where are you from and what sort of things have shaped your perspective?
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Yeah, so I am a licensed marriage and family therapist in California and this is my second career.
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My first career was actually in physical health.
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I was a nutritionist.
00:02:15.889 --> 00:02:28.043
My first master's degree is in nutrition and I myself fell into a very, very, very serious depressive episode where I was barely functioning, needed a therapist.
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You know so much and couldn't find a good one, even though I went to multiple people and every time I thought I think I could do a better job than this person if I were this therapist right now.
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So I went back to school for my second master's in counseling psychology, became a therapist.
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So I'm kind of I guess kind of a populist therapist and I've learned through school in part it gives you some frameworks, but really real life my own life especially and my specialty is anger, because I really see that as the root of all human dysfunction, if we're going to be honest, is how we suppress or I guess the better word that I'm using these days is dissociate from our own anger, because we judge it, we're afraid of it, we think it's shameful.
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We've learned growing up it's evil or bad somehow, and we don't see it as it really is, which is like a light on the dashboard of our emotional car saying that something's wrong.
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You need to check under the hood to bring about resolution, and that's what anger wants us to do.
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It wants us to move towards resolution, not blow up and become quote an angry person, but to channel it out through boundaries, through assertiveness, clarity and accountability.
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Okay.
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So then why do you think anger is usually perceived as a negative emotion or a problem causer in the workplace, if it's actually positive?
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Yeah, well, let's talk about that.
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So you know, josh, you're a parent, I'm a parent, you know.
00:04:00.500 --> 00:04:08.532
Let's be honest, when we have young kids and they're going through their terrible twos, it would be so much nicer if they had zero anger.
00:04:08.532 --> 00:04:12.064
Okay For us, right, For us it would be nicer.
00:04:12.064 --> 00:04:15.281
Not for them, yeah, but for us, you know.
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So the terrible twos, for example, is a necessary developmental stage where the child is first learning he or she is a different, distinct person than especially his mother, his primary attachment figure, and that's called a phase of differentiation.
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So in psychology that's a really like vitally important phase for that child to go through and say no and say mine.
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We have to collaborate with the child to do that successfully and well.
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But if we are the kind of parent who believes that this is all bad and that our job is to dominate the child and teach that child they don't get to say no to us because it's too inconvenient for us, or we have just been taught that that child is inherently evil and this differentiation stage is therefore evil and needs to be quashed, then we're going to teach that child implicitly and probably explicitly, that their anger is shameful and bad and evil, and it might start at two and it might continue and it might especially ramp up during the really important differentiation time which starts around age 10 and goes through, you know, the notorious teenage years.
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But that child needs to differentiate.
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They need to successfully differentiate from the parent in order to be healthy.
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That's not easy for a parent, but it's our job.
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It's not easy for our ego, but it is our job to be the adult and allow them to differentiate from us.
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And it's our job to take the hit.
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And we also can do that with boundaries and parameters.
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We can say you know, I know you don't like it, but you don't get to say whatever you're saying right now.
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This is how you can say it more respectfully so we can help them through it.
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But if our attitude is just to quash it because we feel rejected, because it's painful to our bruised little ego, then we are going to teach that child that the anger is dangerous, it's wrong, it's shameful and it results in abandonment from the parent.
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So that child will suppress their anger and they will dissociate for a lifetime.
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That's heavy.
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But so then, within which constraints can we do that?
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Let's say as parents, for a baseline perspective to this, because I feel like it could be a loaded answer right, depending on how many variables you bring into this.
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But let's just say as parents, within which constraints.
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You know what I mean.
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On one hand of the scale, you've got what's an approach, let's sit down and have quiet time and talk about our feelings and methodology of parenting.
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And on the other hand, you're going to get spanked and you're going to your room and we'll talk about this when I calm down.
00:07:05.329 --> 00:07:06.973
You know type responses.
00:07:06.973 --> 00:07:12.122
What are the constraints you think that are healthiest to approach some of these outbursts or some of these?
00:07:12.163 --> 00:07:35.213
styles, yeah, yeah, well, I mean, I think it's so easy just to go to the polar extremes and I find that the healthiest approaches are always in the middle, living in the tension, where, yes, we're the parent, yes, we are, but we're also human, and they're also human and they also deserve respect.
00:07:35.213 --> 00:07:40.220
And so it's something like, you know, tailor fitted really for each and every situation.
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So it's something like hey, Johnny, you know what?
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I hear that you're angry at mommy, and you know, I don't blame you, I don't blame you at all.
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It's hard to wait your turn and it's hard to forego the cookie that you're used to getting.
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So we can validate his feelings and then say, but you're still not getting the cookie and then say, but you're still not getting the cookie.
00:08:03.742 --> 00:08:29.288
So you know, in psychology we learn there's passive parenting, there's authoritarian parenting, but there's this really healthy approach in the middle called authoritative we're the authority, but we're not authoritarian about it, we're not the dictator, where we're like yeah, Johnny, I get it, you can be angry, but you don't get to say, you know, I hate you mom.
00:08:29.288 --> 00:08:31.372
You can say, mom, that makes me mad.
00:08:31.372 --> 00:08:36.250
So we teach that child how to be a human and we don't shame him for his anger.
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We validate it.
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Of course you're angry.
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You're used to getting the cookie every day at 6 pm and it's hard to change and it's hard to give up things, especially when you don't have any autonomy.
00:08:47.643 --> 00:08:54.065
Right now I have all of it, but we can talk about that, we can give words and language to that and we can validate it.
00:08:54.065 --> 00:08:56.009
And then we say but it's still a no.
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And here's the thing An hour from now you're going to get the cookie.
00:09:00.443 --> 00:09:05.971
So if you can show me some patience, that's going to make mommy really happy and everything's going to work for both of us.
00:09:07.392 --> 00:09:13.427
Okay, so obviously, as they grow up then and sort of emulate similar styles or whatever upbringing they had, right?
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Do you or have you found in your experience so far that preferred style of parenting from one generation to the next tends to stick from that generation to subsequent ones, or does it shift and rebound?
00:09:27.583 --> 00:09:32.395
we're so what we have learned implicitly as children.
00:09:32.395 --> 00:09:44.063
Usually you know that cycle continues when we become parents, unless we, like have an awakening where we're like, you know, don't think the way I was raised was healthy.
00:09:44.063 --> 00:09:52.964
I think it really harmed me in a lot of ways and harmed my relationship with anger and myself and brought a lot of shame or what have you.
00:09:52.964 --> 00:09:59.806
And when we make that conscious effort to learn to do differently, then you know that's really it.
00:09:59.806 --> 00:10:09.774
Otherwise, we're just going to kind of go on autopilot for the most part and find ourselves repeating what we experience, whether we like it or not, unless we do the work.
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All right, folks, stay tight.
00:10:11.943 --> 00:10:13.568
We'll be right back on Transacting Value.
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We're just going to kind of go on autopilot for the most part and find ourselves repeating what we experience, whether we like it or not, unless we do the work.
00:11:24.571 --> 00:11:28.379
Yeah, I think in doing the work sometimes it takes the conscious effort you talked about.
00:11:28.379 --> 00:11:33.299
But I think sometimes it just happens you wake up one day and you're like, wow, I was really rude.
00:11:33.299 --> 00:11:48.417
Or I really need to call somebody and say, dude, my bad, I was hungry yesterday, I hadn't eaten all day, or whatever you know, and try to atone for some of our decisions, whether or not it's in regards to parenting or anything else.
00:11:48.417 --> 00:11:56.942
But I think developing that well, developing that conscious effort, that degree of self-awareness my personal opinion is that's the mark of maturity.
00:11:56.942 --> 00:11:58.957
Not holding everything back.
00:11:59.018 --> 00:12:05.740
You know times and places, I think is a justifiable defense to a lot of things, to being able to control your responses and whatnot.
00:12:05.740 --> 00:12:20.724
But that degree of self-awareness where it's all internal and you start to rationalize, I think that's the sort of threshold, for now you're a mature human being and I don't know that that's only explicit to adulthood.
00:12:20.724 --> 00:12:28.514
I think there's some kids that are, wow, you're pretty mature for your age is an expression I've heard parents say regularly.
00:12:28.514 --> 00:12:38.803
Do you think that's more an accurate reference, that self-awareness equating to maturity, or is it the times and places and responses, outwardly vice, inward?
00:12:38.803 --> 00:12:39.125
Is it the?
00:12:39.205 --> 00:12:40.869
times and places and responses, outwardly vice, inward.
00:12:40.869 --> 00:13:03.192
No, I think you're absolutely right and in fact I'll tell clients who, let's say, they're dating someone or they're contemplating their marriage and if they want to stay married, and I'll tell them the bottom line for hope that you can have is if they are willing to have that self-awareness and that reflection and that introspection.
00:13:04.254 --> 00:13:25.384
That's the basis for hope If that relationship is going to be healthy, moving forward, okay, well, so then how do we identify that you know within a couple years of being engaged or getting married, from the inception of a relationship, like how do you say yeah, okay, you're, you're on it, you figured it out, you know?
00:13:25.543 --> 00:13:29.135
oh, that only takes like that only takes a few days, if that.
00:13:29.135 --> 00:13:35.756
I mean, if you, you know, confront them and they're like, wow, Porter, that's hard for me to hear.
00:13:35.756 --> 00:13:46.640
I'm gonna, but you know, I think you might be right, cause I've been told that before or I do kind of wonder if I'm I'm rude Sometimes I do.
00:13:46.640 --> 00:14:04.072
If you hear that that humility that's what we're talking about is humility, that's what we're really talking about is that posture, that it's a heart posture of humility that's willing to see oneself, to see a reflection of oneself that doesn't feel so good.
00:14:04.072 --> 00:14:13.375
It's willing to see that reflection and go okay, yeah, that's true, and I'm willing to see it and I'm willing to work through that.
00:14:13.375 --> 00:14:23.080
And if someone's not willing, you know you're, you're the mirror and you're giving them a true reflection and they're like no, Porter, that's a you problem.
00:14:23.080 --> 00:14:28.895
You're the reason I'm like this, because you make me angry, because you, you, you.
00:14:28.895 --> 00:14:30.759
That's not a posture of humility.
00:14:30.799 --> 00:15:00.032
That's not a posture of willingness to have introspection and self-reflection and be aware and and really live in reality self-reflection and be aware and really live in reality, live in the truth, yeah, but sometimes that feels accurate to say you know, if you and I are in a relationship and I don't know I'm being rude or whatever the situation is, and you tell me that it's my fault, that something happened, probably because before I came into the picture you were having a great day, you know.
00:15:00.032 --> 00:15:04.322
So I mean, doesn't that accuracy sometimes outweigh the accountability?
00:15:05.129 --> 00:15:06.374
Oh, okay, so we're.
00:15:06.374 --> 00:15:13.620
This is like kind of blurry what you're suggesting, but you know we're all only responsible for our own feelings.
00:15:13.620 --> 00:15:17.711
So you know that's the most important boundary there is.
00:15:17.711 --> 00:15:24.096
It's this big invisible boundary where, Porter, you alone are responsible for your feelings.
00:15:24.096 --> 00:15:26.697
I am not responsible for your feelings.
00:15:26.697 --> 00:15:32.181
I'm responsible to you, but never for you, and vice versa.
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I'm responsible for my feelings, You're responsible for my feelings, You're responsible to me, but never for me.
00:15:37.946 --> 00:15:48.554
So you know, if I say to you, you just make me so angry and I can't help myself and that's why I say all these horrible things to you I lose it.
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I'm not myself.
00:15:49.316 --> 00:15:58.342
That is a blurring of boundaries, that's a bypassing of, like natural, very real boundaries.
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I cannot blame my behavior because I alone am responsible for my behavior.
00:16:03.799 --> 00:16:07.099
You are never responsible for my behavior.
00:16:07.099 --> 00:16:07.801
You can't be.
00:16:07.801 --> 00:16:16.019
So I'm trying to blur those boundaries, I'm trying to put that on you when it can never be from you.
00:16:16.019 --> 00:16:19.298
Never, no one can ever make me do anything.
00:16:19.298 --> 00:16:26.376
Only I am responsible for my behavior and how I react and respond to my feelings.
00:16:27.057 --> 00:16:39.178
But me recognizing in this example that I may have instigated those triggers makes me responsible if we were in a relationship, makes me responsible for trying to identify what about my behavior?
00:16:39.178 --> 00:16:40.629
Is a trigger to you?
00:16:40.629 --> 00:16:42.114
I could play that role.
00:16:42.735 --> 00:16:43.517
Yeah, okay.
00:16:43.517 --> 00:16:57.740
So let's say, you, you do say something really hurtful and then I lose it and I just like say horrible things back to you Like it's a real phenomenon, okay, so when you say those hurtful things to me, I feel hurt.
00:16:57.740 --> 00:17:03.451
I feel, maybe, of course, those hurtful things to me.
00:17:03.451 --> 00:17:03.692
I feel hurt.
00:17:03.692 --> 00:17:04.593
I feel maybe, of course, angry, maybe betrayed.
00:17:04.593 --> 00:17:06.877
So those are my feelings, only my feelings, and only I am responsible for them.
00:17:06.877 --> 00:17:10.132
So I have choices over what I do with them.
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If I'm choosing to be responsible with my feelings, I'm going to use my words, because that's what grownups do, that's what mature people do they use their words.
00:17:20.440 --> 00:17:22.746
I'm going to use my words because that's what grownups do, that's what mature people do they use their words.
00:17:22.746 --> 00:17:29.849
I'm going to say, porter, you know, when you say that, I don't think you realize how hurtful that is, that's really hurtful and I just can't listen to that anymore.
00:17:29.849 --> 00:17:37.656
If we're going to hang out together like I can't be around that because I don't want to say something I regret and I'm about to.
00:17:37.656 --> 00:17:46.701
So that's how I am responsible for my own feelings is I use my words and I express it, and that's me being assertive with you.
00:17:46.701 --> 00:17:56.054
I'm not being aggressive, I'm being assertive, but again so kind of like those extremes I keep talking about in the healthy middle most of us don't know exists.
00:17:56.736 --> 00:18:01.916
Most people confuse aggressiveness with assertiveness and so they're passive.
00:18:01.916 --> 00:18:06.755
They go to the other extreme because they're afraid of being aggressive or they're passive.
00:18:06.755 --> 00:18:37.636
Aggressive, right, but really if we're assertive, that's where we're responsible with our feelings and to the other person, and then you can say you can, you know, depending on how you feel, when you hear me say that you might feel ashamed, and so you can say you can, you know, depending on how you feel, when you hear me say that you might feel ashamed, and so you can be responsible with your feeling of shame and say wow, bronwyn, I'm really actually ashamed of myself when I hear how much I'm saying hurts you and I didn't even know that and that's hard for me to hear.
00:18:38.309 --> 00:18:55.853
I'm going to take some time and really think about that and get back to you the reality check moment, I guess, yeah, yeah, yeah, well, okay, so there have been, you said, aggression and, and I guess, passivity, uh, and then a middle ground, right, and combinations of any of these aspects.
00:18:55.853 --> 00:19:04.721
Yeah, for clarity, is aggression primarily qualified by a physical response or outburst in addition to anger, or how?
00:19:04.781 --> 00:19:05.505
are you aggressiveness?
00:19:05.705 --> 00:19:08.654
yeah, how are you qualifying aggression in this continuum?
00:19:08.755 --> 00:19:13.307
yeah, so aggressiveness can just be me attacking you.
00:19:13.307 --> 00:19:14.830
I mean, that's usually how it is.
00:19:14.830 --> 00:19:17.796
So there's a term I think is really important to talk about.
00:19:17.796 --> 00:19:19.378
It's called DARVO.
00:19:19.378 --> 00:19:22.483
It's an acronym, and it stands for DARVO.
00:19:23.131 --> 00:19:24.958
It stands for deny.
00:19:24.958 --> 00:19:27.719
This would be the ultimate act of aggression.
00:19:27.719 --> 00:19:33.338
And this happens like once you learn this concept, you're going to see it probably every day of your life.
00:19:33.338 --> 00:19:35.837
So unfortunately, it stands for deny.
00:19:35.837 --> 00:19:43.223
So let's say you say to me, bronwyn, you know that's really, it's really hurtful when you say that.
00:19:43.223 --> 00:19:58.198
So if I'm a grownup, if I'm willing to have that reflection and introspection and willingness to have that posture of humility when you say that to me, I'm going to say, okay, wow, I'm going to really think about that.
00:19:58.198 --> 00:20:00.397
Thank you for bringing that to my attention.
00:20:00.397 --> 00:20:04.142
That's it's hard to hear Like I'm fighting shame right now.
00:20:04.142 --> 00:20:13.736
But I hear you and I respect what you're saying and I want to take it into consideration and maybe give me some time and I'll think through it and contemplate and get back to you.
00:20:13.736 --> 00:20:21.192
So, but if I'm not willing to do that, then I'm going to probably DARVO you, and this is what most people do, unfortunately.
00:20:21.653 --> 00:20:25.106
Darvo it means deny attack.
00:20:25.106 --> 00:20:31.423
Okay, and this is aggressiveness deny attack and then reverse victim and offender.
00:20:31.423 --> 00:20:42.378
So I might say something like well, I guess I'm just the worst friend ever, so that's a Darvo, cause I'm what am I doing?
00:20:42.378 --> 00:20:53.954
That's like a that's kind of a funny one, like you see that in movies and TV a lot that kind of Darvo Cause it's kind of funny, it's, but it is a type of Darvo is, what am I doing If I'm successful?
00:20:53.954 --> 00:20:56.476
When I say that, what have I just done?
00:20:56.476 --> 00:21:04.897
Now you are comforting me, most likely because I've become the victim and you're saying that's not true, bronwyn, you're not the horrible friend.
00:21:04.897 --> 00:21:08.011
So if I'm successful, I'm the victim.
00:21:08.011 --> 00:21:16.433
Now you're comforting and reassuring me and I've just derailed the conversation away from your confrontation.
00:21:21.261 --> 00:21:23.785
from that which is living in reality.
00:21:23.785 --> 00:21:31.682
And now we're living in this delusional construct where I'm the victim and you're the offender and you've hurt me.
00:21:31.682 --> 00:21:32.805
Look at that, Voila.
00:21:32.805 --> 00:21:34.236
How did I do that so quickly?
00:21:35.852 --> 00:21:38.210
Alrighty, folks sit tight and we'll be right back on Transacting Value.
00:21:45.612 --> 00:21:48.192
All right, folks, sit tight and we'll be right back on Transacting Value.
00:21:58.016 --> 00:22:05.248
And now we're living in this delusional construct where I'm the victim and you're the offender and you've hurt me.
00:22:05.248 --> 00:22:06.329
Look at that, voila.
00:22:06.329 --> 00:22:07.780
How did I do that so quickly?
00:22:08.694 --> 00:22:19.060
Well, ok, but isn't that sort of subjective then, Like in your example, the two friends right Maybe I'm just the worst friend ever, the points you just brought up Isn't that sort of subjective then?
00:22:19.060 --> 00:22:27.644
Because, you may be, party A were offended first and now party B feels offended, but so how is one any more offensive or aggressive?
00:22:27.644 --> 00:22:28.366
You know what I?
00:22:28.386 --> 00:22:32.403
mean yeah, but see you're getting lost in the algorithm here.
00:22:32.403 --> 00:22:32.763
Yeah.
00:22:32.763 --> 00:22:46.226
The point is, your feelings were hurt by something I said and that's what I'm trying to deny, I'm trying to move away from, and that's manipulative, like a deflection.
00:22:46.807 --> 00:22:50.825
Yes, so it's always about the original person.
00:22:50.825 --> 00:23:01.287
So what I would encourage you to do, as that original person, is say okay, I hear that you don't want to talk about what I just brought up.
00:23:01.287 --> 00:23:07.885
It sounds like that's really hard for you to admit, Bronwyn, that what you are saying is hurtful.
00:23:07.885 --> 00:23:11.479
It sounds like you really don't want to talk about it right now, bronwyn.
00:23:11.479 --> 00:23:12.019
Is that right?
00:23:12.019 --> 00:23:18.844
So I would just go right to the heart of it double down right through the BS and just stay there.
00:23:19.405 --> 00:23:20.688
Stay there, stay there, stay there.
00:23:20.688 --> 00:23:24.506
Don't let that person manipulate you away from reality.
00:23:24.506 --> 00:23:26.460
You know it's in reality.
00:23:26.981 --> 00:23:33.685
It's interesting yeah, that's easier said than done sometimes the interesting point and interesting point that you just brought up.
00:23:33.685 --> 00:23:45.863
So, for anybody new to the show, most of my career has been in the Marine Corps infantry and up until a few months ago I got my real estate license in Florida tree, and up until a few months ago I got my real estate license in Florida.
00:23:45.863 --> 00:24:12.087
And so now, in doing that, one of the things that you just sort of tipped off in my head this may not be a foreign concept to a lot of people, but in case it is, I'll break it down in a couple of seconds there's a comparative market assessment that realtors can do, basically to determine a more accurate price valuation for a property Buyers, sellers, doesn't matter, but for any particular property, sort of like what you might see on Zillow as a Zestimate or whatever right, where that may focus on objective data number crunching.
00:24:12.087 --> 00:24:29.503
And then a realtor can come in and say, okay, yeah, but what's not factored in there is the fact that nobody actually walks to that school, everybody drives because there's no sidewalks, and so the fact that it's close to a school, that Zestimate says it's higher, when really actually it doesn't add any value to that property and so we can tweak it more accurately, right?
00:24:29.503 --> 00:24:51.304
My point being is that in learning that process, especially for new realtors or even new brokers in some states, to be able to say I need to focus on the subject property, the one originating property that I started trying to value, and then I pull in comparable properties and say, well, this original one, the subject property, has three bedrooms and the comparable one has four.
00:24:51.304 --> 00:24:55.205
So the value of an additional bedroom in that neighborhood is X amount.
00:24:55.205 --> 00:25:05.961
I'll subtract it from that comparable sold property and then, over a few comparable properties, this is the average price point for our subject property, right, and you start taking it one variable at a time.
00:25:06.723 --> 00:25:23.086
What's easy to do is get distracted by these other properties and these other qualifiers within these properties and attributes within these properties that you lose sight of the subject one and it becomes this new equation altogether, because it's easy to get, you know, to lose focus.
00:25:23.086 --> 00:25:34.198
Right, I was, I've never actually balanced out in my head until just now, with everybody listening, apparently in public, that what you're talking about emotionally actually had some resonance with property values.
00:25:34.198 --> 00:25:36.566
But I thought that was interesting, just to share with you in concept.
00:25:36.566 --> 00:25:40.566
And so now, saying all those things, though, right, trying to keep focus.
00:25:41.335 --> 00:25:45.397
You brought up parenting earlier, so not to harp on it, but to retrace for a second.
00:25:45.397 --> 00:25:56.645
That's easy to do and almost devalue a two-year-old's perspective, even though they're the originating party saying you don't talk to me like that.
00:25:56.645 --> 00:26:00.407
Linda, you listen the little kid, have you seen those videos?
00:26:00.407 --> 00:26:03.769
Oh well, anyway, yeah, he says you listen to me.
00:26:03.769 --> 00:26:06.833
Or the mom, she says you listen to me and he says no, linda, you listen.
00:26:06.833 --> 00:26:14.036
And it goes.
00:26:14.036 --> 00:26:15.082
It goes back and forth, right, and so what about then?
00:26:15.082 --> 00:26:17.634
Because you can't give too much credibility, because they're learning boundaries and parameters and responses.
00:26:18.256 --> 00:26:23.065
I haven't seen that video, but I can't imagine that little boy didn't learn that from.
00:26:23.065 --> 00:26:24.949
He's emulating his father right now.
00:26:24.949 --> 00:26:31.201
I'm pretty sure he learned that from somebody's father and he's probably his father.
00:26:31.201 --> 00:26:39.295
Anyway, you know, that's not going to happen for the most part, for most of us, hopefully that level of antagonism from a small child.
00:26:39.295 --> 00:26:42.041
But I will say so.
00:26:42.102 --> 00:26:42.722
Here's the thing.
00:26:42.722 --> 00:26:59.980
If we're going back to the posture of our heart and the humility as a parent, my child has intrinsic value and worth, and you can say you love your child to your blue in the face, but unless you're actually loving that child with your action, that means nothing to them.
00:26:59.980 --> 00:27:10.042
And when we learn to validate their feelings again, we don't have to give them what they want to validate their feelings.
00:27:10.042 --> 00:27:14.019
We can say you know what you are angry at, mommy, and that's okay.
00:27:14.019 --> 00:27:17.288
I don't blame you, but this is what's going to happen.
00:27:17.288 --> 00:27:32.026
So when we do that, though, what we're doing implicitly is we're teaching them that they matter, because when their feelings matter to us, they learn that they matter to us.
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